thanatopsis_awry

Your hair looks prittyprittty good! I don't know much about Dr. Pong, but I've heard some good/interesting things. I've been more knowledgeable about Dr. Path, who I think recently was accepted into being reccommended by HTN. It seems you kind of fell into the HT, so I'm extra-happy you got a result your very pleased with -- recipe for disaster most of the time!

Thx Aaron. I would say....if you are "very" bald, concealer is still your best bet. I think this regiment is *perfect* for someone who has had a HT, though. The issues we deal with: the illusion of density and naturalness are met reallyreallyreally well by this regiment, and in a way that concealers couldn't even touch. Personally, nanogen and dermmatch can't even do *that* much for me right now -- with how my hair is, my goals, how I want to style it, concealers simply aren't geared at this, and they aren't that effective. On top of their detectability, which becomes more difficult to contain when you *have* a good deal of hair that you want to style, but you don't have *that* much true density.

I just read Bill's post in the other thread that spawned this one. And I agree in large part with what was said -- I draw a distinction, however, with what NotJustY is saying. Dr's prices won't move in perfect harmony; Dr. Feller charging 10/g doesn't truly reflect the state of FUE. Perhaps, because Dr. Feller has charged 10/g, and because of his drive to advance FUE, it has helped pave the way for what has happened: other doctors advancing and mastering FUE, and other doctors charging less. SMG is a perfect example of this, but they aren't the only doctors to recently become more and more immersed in FUE. I would not assail Bill's position. What I do assail his NotJustY's position which *itself* is assailing others. The irony is the very people he is personally assailing (e.g. Dr. Feller and those who don't want to publically flog him for his pricing) are the very people who are integral in the *process* of competition and the lowering of FUE's price.

Looks quite nice to me, too. Did you know prior to surgery that the patient desired the "caesar" style of hair? I know Dr. Feller posted a case once where he knew the patient wanted to maintain that style, and so he weighted the grafts differently (if I remember aright) to best serve this style, vs. someone who might want to push their hair up.

I agree 100% with the above. The work is nice and excellent, as usual, and it's very admirable to see you continue your efforts and pride into your documentation. It might be redundant to keep continually praising you as such, but until the types of steps you take are the norm, rather than the exception, I think it's prudent to keep calling attention to this area of underlooked HT excellence.

You're incorrect on two levels, firstly. I've simply been calling out and dissecting your emotions, which you've continued into this post; more importantly, the expression you're trying to label me with is "pot calling the kettle black". Anyways, I know facts can be stubborn things, so I'll reiterate one last time what has already been said, and what can already be gleaned by the cold hard facts of reality -- the price of FUE *is* going down, as it already *has* gone down. This is a fact. So your entire first paragraph, including the emotional-label of calling people who disagree with you "cheerleaders" is 100% incorrect. You don't like to cheerlead for "docs prices", but I do wish you'd cheerlead for the facts that exist and are being reiterated in this (and other) threads for your consumption, instead of rehashing your emotional, subjective desires and projecting that onto what you think society must look like and how private enterprise operates. Your second paragraph suffers from the same ailment as your first -- it is based in non-reality, as there is excellent competition within FUE, with an upward trend. This is a fact. And as I already stated, the competition is on the rise. This is a process. It isn't static, it is dynamic, it is in play, and it is moving along at an excellent pace. You seem more concerned with wanting to control how much money an individual can make than the actual events going on that actually impact the very thing you purport to be so concerned with -- that is, competition within FUE, and the subsequent drive of the price becoming more competitive across the HT landscape. This is what's happening, whether or not it perfectly conforms with your obsession over how wealthy and luxurious the lives of skilled, effective doctors are living. PS I think Dr. Feller is a saint for not raising his FUE price to 11/graft. How could you not agree with me when he could so easily be charging more than what he currently charges and make even more money to gain even more country club memberships? PPS The very real, very important facet of this discussion that hasn't even been discussed is the incentive for doctors to spend their money/time on braving new advancements in FUE, expressly benefiting patients worldwide, and one in the same serving to ultimately lower the price of FUE as productivity and ability increases. Ironically, yet not actually surprising, Dr. Feller is an absolute leader in this regard.

In retrospect, I possibly should have posted this in the Shampoo/Concealer section. Though, I truly feel *incredibly* strongly in how effective this regiment is, and think it could be a huge boon for a lot of people who have had HTs.

I can't prove with exactitude that this is The Best, but after years of extremely thorough if not outright insane testing and comparing, I feel confident in the following system of hair care for the HT, ultimately perfected when I was trying to combat a brutal shed I was experiencing. The three tenants throughout research: density (the illusion and actual increase), naturalness (both undetectability of product *and* boosting the naturalness of the HT itself), health (is the stuff actually good for your hair and scalp, hair-geekdom aside). Without further ado, and with much labor behind it: a) Aveda Pure Abundance Clay Shampoo and Conditioner. The key ingrediant is 'acacia gum', which is the *only* ingrediant in a shampoo that I have *ever* felt actually improves the density and fullness of your hair. That aside, it makes hair more manageable, has a nice, fairly masculine scent, and is very good for sensitive scalps, as well. *a lot goes a long way. b)Samy Fat Hair Thickening Cream. This is a cream that essentially mimics what a volumizing mousse might try to do. Except it works better than any other product on the market in its class. Interestingly, while it does add extra fullness to your hair, the most remarkable thing is the following: it tames HT hair like nothing else, while not sacrificing density, but actually increasing it alongside this amazing benefit. This product facilitates naturalness and the ability to easily style your hair as you choose. c) Blow Dry. Use a blow dryer following this, tilting your head downward, and when head upright blowdrying the hairs in an inward and upward way. The heat activates the thickening agents, and fully and seamlessly meshes the aforesaid product(s) with your hair. d) Aveda Pure Abundance Hair Potion. Many people are reticent to use a "concealer". Aveda Hair Potion is the perfect middleman. It's an incredibly unique rooted in "acacia gum" being dispensed in the most effective, and result-producing manner. It is little white specs, not unlike small pieces of salt, except when lightly sprinkled onto your hands and rubbed together....disappears in a bizarre emulsification process. When you scrunch and do a mock-run of styling your hair with your fingers it transfers the product in a 100% seamless, undetectable way. The result: density and fullness is added to your hair -- particularly effective and special in that it can be used directly on the hairline in utterly seamless fashion -- and, it gives lots of texture to your hair which can allow more effective (and easy) styling options. *a problem with having "actual" texture added to your hair by way of a stylist going to work is that density can be sacrificed, so in addition to the thickening effect, this a nice ancillary benefit. e) Blow Dry. One more time, quickly. *this step is a personal choice of sorts, and I wouldn't consider it essential. f) Dirt. Described as "designed to easily give you the amazing way your hair looks and behaves the day after washing". In a word, this product is: perfection. It feels like space-age material, and is a totally uniqur hybrid of a wax and paste. It is the best styling product I have ever used, hands down -- both in controlling your hair, increasing perceived density, and, uniquely, it gives a "movie star" look in that while it's potency is incredible and incredibly varied, it doesn't look like you even have all this product in your hair. *Jonathan's Dirt is the original product, and what I prefer. It's expensive, though, and there is a generic version by FX called Texture Dirt, which is a knockoff. It's dirt cheap (badoomching), but works pretty similiarly. **I'll often mix in some Cristoff Texturizing Paste with Dirt, as the Cristoff product is slightly better at adding density to hair. I don't consider this essential, but I'm OCD about my hair and will often do this to just max out every possible angle of working the HT to its best. That's it. One time affair and my hair will hold and stay cool till I shower next. IMHO, this is the Holy Grail of hair care, particularly if you've had a HT.

The price of FUE is precisely where it should be. The crux is that there is competition, incentive, and diversity of choice at play -- and there is. The specific #s associated with given doctors are really irrelevant, insofar as the aforementioned variables are in play. The #s that tag along for the ride are what they are; attempting to infiltrate (aside from simply not partaking and validating) in what a given doctor charges isn't just ineffective, but counterproductive in the horrible precadent it sets were other people to actually follow suit and play the same game. A million lines in the sand can be drawn from a million people in a million different places and none carry more individual worth, justice, righteousness, or fairness than the other. Wanting to play economic King Kong and make blazing (and blazingly subjective and relative) statements about what a given doctor "should" be charging re-directs where the focus should be, and infuses the arena with unnecessary emotion that simply isn't germane. You can postulate -- and speculate -- on what a doctor *could* charge, but the same can't be said for what a doctor *should* charge. And traffic moves both ways, of course: Dr. X could possibly go from 10/g to 7/g; he could also quite easily go to 11/g and make more money. Is he now a saint for not going to 11/g? In actuality, there is a clear downward trend in the price of FUE, while the quality remains on the rise. We truly couldn't ask -- nor should we want -- much more.

Haha, I didn't think of that...I wonder if too much time has elapsed since the incident...**frivalous-lawsuit gears grinding**

I certainly don't want to go out of my way to paint a gloomy picture for you, particularly since I know so little of the specifics/pictures; and, as I mentioned above I think there's a good chance those other variables could likely be in play. But, given what you've said about shockloss and how your procedure seems to have been undertaking a densifying within an area of rather abundant existing hair....transection/permanent shockloss is something to keep in mind. Hopefully, your native hair grows back in tandem with your HT in the coming months. Was your native hair terminal/strong or vellus/miniaturized? If the native hair was weak and vellus I'd be more inclined to think that you either experienced continual MPB or hairs that were "on their way out" simply met a bit early of a death. IMO, prcoedures that look to achieve high density within pre-existing areas of native hair are the most...risky....but mainly just the most difficult and taxing. It's counter-intuitive since the # of grafts is often somewhat low compared to the vaunted "mega session" and it seems like a "simple" refining should be....simple. If you have a good camera I'd post some pics -- pre-ops and where you're at now, with how many grafts you got. Either way, I'd def do this a couple months down the road and/or get your doctor to give you pics he took (or have him post them on your behalf). Stay strong, though I know how tough it must be. You're at a difficult stage where fear can quickly set in -- but having what we often think of as a "good" result at 6months is more the rarity than the norm. If you feel this way at 8months...even 7months...I'd be a lot more concerned.

The hair you've lost in the hairline -- when did you lose it? It could be shockloss, the question of course is whether it's temporary or if hairs were actually transected during the process of implanting in a relatively dense area. Also, look into getting your case and photos put onto this site; if your doctor is highly regarded it shouldn't be too difficult.

I can certainly appreciate how troubling this must be for you. Nonetheless: there's a decent chance some permutation of the following is taking place: you're simply a slow-grower, you've actually had more growth than you imagine. The latter is *really* common, IMHO, especially for people ~6 months out. Have you had bad shockloss or anything? If you've truly had "no" growth to this point I'd be concerned, but don't panic as the next several months are really when a lot of growth booms occur. I wish you the best in the coming months, and def update with specifics for better or worse as they come.

NotJust is manifesting his fascist tendencies and directing his inane economic outlook onto Dr. Feller. I would just love to know the minutiae of every dude's life who acts like a righteous king kong on the price of Feller's FUE (or any doctor's HT) and rip their financial decisions to shreds with the exact inane subjectivity they themselves put on display with righteous pretense. We get it, you wish HTs were cheaper because the price is crucial to you and anything contradicting your price threshhold is upsetting. Ok. That's fine. It's fine for many others regardless. Now just let it be and stop beating a dead horse that doesn't even exist. edit, to the OP -- the work looks great, and I'm confident that some months down the road you will be extremely satisfied and proud of your investment. edit 2 -- in retro, NotJust actually takes his self-righteous act to a somewhat offensive (but mostly laughable) level by passive-aggressively attempting to besmirch anyone who dare defy his holy wisdom of finance and the economy; though, were I was pitching and looking to debate as hollow and muddied a position as he I might look to cheapen the debate as much as possible, too.

huh? lul

Call me ol' fashioned, but I agree 110% that buying condoms is 110% more embarassing. I seriously can't do it at an actual store...kills me, and in the past I've gone through great pains to ensure that the transaction goes down in the most covert, secretive manner possible. My most embarassing pharmacy experience was w/ propecia, though. This insolent girl behind the counter who I've long disliked had this incredibly loud Long Island accent, and when I asked for my fin she blurted out, much within the earshot of the people right behind me, "why would you want *propecia*, you aren't *bald* are you?".....damn fool.

His HT would have had to have been FUE. And it would have had to have been done a while ago, with pristine scarring (or lackthereof), making it pretty unlikely. Btw, I see what you're saying Juan -- but the customer isn't always right, though neither is a doctor, per say. It takes two to tango. Getting a HT at a very young age can be acceptable and it happens -- and it gets performed by the best doctors, of whom are recommended by this site. But there are still plenty of legit reasons why a doc might turn you down, and if it is by an esteemed doctor you should take extreme heed.

Seriously consider the gravitas of essentially going through a sex change transformation. There are untold risks associated with this, besides from the crux -- which is that you are doing a de facto sex change operation. Clearly, right now your mind is flooded by thoughts of hairloss and only hairloss; it won't always be this way. What are your objective thoughts on getting a sex change operation, irrespective of hair? Considering your expectations and proclivities, I truly believe a top notch hair system is best for you. You will get infinitely superior hair, sans risk, compared to a sex change in an infinitely easier way, you will get it ASTAT, and....you won't be going through a sex change. As well, keep in mind that this route buys you infinite time, and you can adapt and react as new advances come, as they may very well in the coming years. You're obsessed -- and possessed -- by your hair right now. Don't make a truly life-altering, monumentally complex choice in this frame of mind, IMHO.

Ya, I wasn't really impugning OP's charachter -- just curious since it's curious to see such a first post with a lot put into it. It does seems like a bit of a hit job, IMHO, though I suppose that doesn't necessarily negate the things within the post itself. I'm still sitting on the sidelines a bit longer w/ PRP till' a thread like this can come along and it doesn't spook me in any way.

A worthy adversary to replace the now antiquated LLLT debates...lol.... You sure you're just some random newbie, young balding guy looking for solutions? A bit odd seeing such a detailed, thought-out, comprehensive (1st) post on a forum (not to mention controversial).

I like your attitude KWIH, as bizarre as that might sound given the circumstances. I've been where you're at -- in a different scenery of cosmos I'm there right now. I guess I'd just say to hang tight as long as possible till' you find an option(s) that you are alright with and can move forward with. I'd also consult with Hasson and Wong ASAP to see if you can get the absolutely boatload of hair moved in one go around which it seems you might demand.

I'm considering; for the helluva it, and also for illusion purposes. But can dying your hair detract from the actual quality/thickness of your hairs, or is it simply the color that changes and all other components of your hair remain the same?

I'm considering; for the helluva it, and also for illusion purposes. But can dying your hair detract from the actual quality/thickness of your hairs, or is it simply the color that changes and all other components of your hair remain the same?

BCAA's are a really interesting -- and I think good -- idea, re: recovery for an athlete, or weightlifter getting a HT. The one caveat I'd add is that to truly benefit you need to consume a truly hefty load (I forget how many grams per pound of lean mass, but it's a ton)and they are pretty expensive and/or taste horrible. But, when I take time off from my next HT I'd absolutely be loading up on BCAA's for preservation purposes and peace of mind.

Jotronic sometimes posts the ultimate manifesto on why "to shave"; it's floating around in a few threads, and was written by Hasson, I believe. Not sure where it is, but prolly findable and maybe if Jotronic sees this thread he can post the link if he has it readily available. Many doctors don't shave, however, in fact I'd say most who are "reccomended" do not.