thanatopsis_awry

One question I've had, which I've been making an assumption about, is that if Dr. X (let's say Feller or Rahal, like NJ mentions) perform a 5k session on someone....does this then mean that they have the ability to perform 5k on *anyone*, assuming they feel it to be appropriate, and the patient's charachteristics are in line? So, if Patient X goes to H&W and receives ~5k, does it follow that, strictly in terms of graft #s, he could have gone to Feller/Rahal/____ and received a very similiar graft #?

Do a consult with the docs you have mentioned, and ask as many questions as you can think of -- then compare and contrast their respective thoughts, and see which fits the best for you. You could also post some pics on the forum afterwards and can get various viewpoints on graft estimates and the like. But, first and foremost, I would start doing the consults -- Feller and H&W are very experienced at online consults, so don't worry about only being able to do a good (live) consult w/ the local clinic(s).

I've never heard of them either, which is somewhat suspect in and of itself, especially considering you couldn't find objective information on them either. Looking at their website, it seems they center on FUE, and are promoting a lot of hype about it (scar-free...."Follicular Transfer" tecnique....; with FUE in general, you need to be extremely cautious as so much deceit surrounds it. Are you intent on doing FUE (as opposed to FUT) in England? I don't believe they do FUE, but Farjo's are considered by many to be the best HT clinic in the UK. I would look in that direction, and also consult w/ some Canadian or U.S. clinics, especially with such a favorable exchange rate and the good deals that can be had.

Congrats on your decision! I think it is a sound one, and one that I would prolly' make, as well. You are really going to be a hairy-SOB....

I used the Coalition has a springboard to start deciding which docs I should get serious about looking into. I also factored in "forum reputations" to narrow things a bit more -- that is, which doctors seem to be consistently getting rave reviews across the forums. Consultations can't be over-emphasized in my opinion, and I wish I had actually partaken in more; even in retrospect it isn't that I would have ended up with a different decision, but I simply wish I had amassed more knowledge, generally speaking. Born from consultations, figuring out what each respective "prognosis" means, and comparing/contrasting would be next; at the same time, inquiring into specific cases to be shown throughout the consult is very important, as is researching cases on the forums. I got a bit lucky, also, to be honest. I was an emotional wreck when I first started thinking about HTs, and I easily could have ended up running into a brickwall, ending up @ some butcher....it just so happened that the first HT commercial/endorsement I ever saw was for T&D, as an infomercial, actually, which then led me to this site and got me started on a sound path.

Intra-op pain is really non-existent, and you just have to contend with the initial numbing shots; which are pretty annoying "stings", but you may very well be so excited in general that you will get through it without much thought. Post-op pain.....personally, once my initial painkillers wore off from the surgery, I felt some moderate+ pain for about 1.5hours that night.....it definitely hurt, but between finding a good movie to watch and just the general excitement -- and exhaustion -- from the day's preceedings it coulda been a lot worse. Other than those two, pretty shortlived instances of mild to moderate pain, there were no issues. As others have mentioned, the last hour or two in the operating room was the most arduous, and I am *very* happy I got a massage the night before! I would rate the pain, though, in the spirit of HairThere: Shots -- 3 Surgery -- 0 Post-Op -- 0, except for that night which I'd give a 6 Staple Removal -- .25

Wex, nobody is going to be buying your shilling here......so blatent....

Horrible....completely, 100% unsurprising....but horrible nonetheless....PGP, as annoying n' frustrating as it can be to try to talk to some of these young, emotional (prospective and otherwise) Armani guys, still sucks to see the results flow forth, as predictable as they are, eh? "The Barber of SeVille" meets "The Bosley of FUE"....

"beachair", since you seem so quick to judge not just NG2 but also veteran members of this forum, you should filter your words through this lens, and see how that relfects upon yourself: NG2 comforted more people in need; posed more salient questions; and brought more humor to an otherwise depressive people in a single hour than you have done in a year, and most likely more than you will do in the next two.

Bill, In the other thread I was just answering the poster's disbelief in why so many people where being so vocal; which is because many simply like NG2 and feel he is an asset, but also, as some have stated in this thread and the others, they feel it is about a larger issue as well surrounding people being able to express their opinions. Personally, I really don't really feel threatened about my speach and posting on the forum; I believe that NG2's expulsion was principally based off of heated words between he and Pat in private correspondence, and that as zany as NG2 was in the open forums, he is not getting the "death penalty" over those postings, specifically. I'm sympathetic with those who feel NG2's exit is a symptom of a much larger problem -- I myself haven't thought that through enough, but I see how they could be concerned, and it is certaintly something has crossed my mind as well. Listening to some veteran posters, this is clearly a concern of theirs, and is definitely why there has been such an uproar. It hasn't just been about NG2 and NG2 alone for some. I agree though that there is no reason to continue this debate, and each member will have to make a decision as to whether NG2's suspension is worth leaving, based off of this judgement.

So NG2 is banned for spreading terrible information, insulting the site, and harming it....from his *public* postings....looking at his "body of work", it is clear that he finds this community to be superior. **You would be hard pressed to find a newb that he talked with and advised who would say he hurt him, and you yourself would be hard pressed to say he hurt him, as well; while NG2 could easily rattle off numerous people who he has given tremendous support to, some of whom have already said as much.** Does this all not count for something? To say nothing of the countless hours he has spent humoring AND giving support AND asking and answering pointed questions....? Sure, he says things which some disagree with, -- e.g., digging in to Dr. Epstein's techs over their partying the night before....thinking there are big differences between doctors within the Coalition...But matters like this are just so harmless, and even if they are patently false, at the very least they are topics which warrant at least some discussion over. I'll say it again, but in spite of his very narrow view of which doctors he would go to, when he dispenses advice to people looking into doctors, I don't recall him ever badgering someone on their decision, or even belaboring out of the blue the doctors that he personally likes. Much like *most* posters, included some who are paid, he normally simply says to look in the direction of X, X, and X....And he is never malicious. I would hate to leave this site, and it would be difficult for me to just "quit"; but if NG2's death meens the exit of *other* veteran posters, as well.....well, the forum will indeed have taken a mighty blow. Truly, I hope that NG2's expulsion, particularly in light of its ripple effects, is being made with clear, cogent, and objective intent. And I will repeat once again, whatever he said in Private Messages was truly shaped by him initially feeling -- correct or not --condescended to and belittled.

You clearly don't understand that NG2's expulsion is indicative of a much larger issue to many -- a symptom. The reason many are so intensely vocal about this is because they feel that they have given to this community, and become a part of it -- NG2 included -- and that it is being disassembled. And being disassembled for reasons many don't understand, or agree with. To say not just NG2, but others' opinions should be kept mum, and to simply "let Pat do what he needs to do" is ridiculous. Nonetheless, Pat, of course, shouldn't be insulted.

I agree w/ HT55 about using the foam and propecia for a while, especially with where the hairloss is centered. At but 25, and working in the crown region, it's kinda tough...but I would say you'd want ~4k, at least at this point in time. Definitely keep on the minox and fin, and get a bunch of quotes/prognoses from various clinics....would be interested to see what they recommend.

Bad scar....unnatural looking hair growth....not nearly enough grafts to satisfy your balding area(s)? The good thing is that it sounds like you've had but one bad procedure; Bosley is (one of the....) cesspools of the industry, but fortunately there are some truly tremendous doctors that can work wonders with "repair cases", like it seems you yourself may be.

Damn...that is righteous news! And I completely agree about how important hair is -- even moreso than *weight*....*hair* is THE greatest decider in someone's overall aesthetics..... Anyways, that is seriously awesome to hear....you must teach me your ways, Master Wangthairs....where do you live, perhaps we could organize a Womanizing Workshop in the New England area specifically catered towards balding bozos and those considering HTs....

Thx, was lookin' for that. Quite a change in attitude....tough one, can definitely understand his emotional concerns going into hyperdrive with the recent wave of bizarre cases.....but I agree that everyone needs to recognize that until proven otherwise, Dr. Epstein....Kev....TTDS....are all on the same team.

Just when there seemed to be some clarity.... Kev, to understand the timetable better -- your (public) worry over growth @ 6 months (which we can all agree is a ~3+ months to get a solid handle on things) became more intense after TTDS came out with his "Nine Month Report"?

Bill, He mentioned that a guy (I also remember him saying he was middle-eastern, but could be mistaken on that) who had received north of 8k....I don't remember if he stated if it was 8400, 8500, etc., but I def recall that it was clearly over 8k....this was 2-3months ago, if I had to guess, and was a Hasson patient. Didn't get any more details as I was speachless!

Btw, Hairbank, on the subject of session sizing, unless I'm badly mistaken, Jotronic mentioned that someone had well over 8k in a single session a few months back, though the case was never presented to a forum...pretty insane, eh?

KevKristy, I'm seriously sorry that what is already an emotionally tumultuous, difficult process has been made into an even greater whirlpool of doubt and anxiety. Nonetheless, you have the forum's support, and you still have plenty of time to make leaps and bounds in growth. I trust that Dr. Epstein or his new forum rep will get back to you on your aforementioned concerns/statements.

I pretty much agree with everything PleaseGrowPlease has said. Dr. Epstein's reputatation shouldn't be ruined by a few cases that are not even yet complete; but the said cases are also quite troubling in and of themselves, and should be met with seriousness and compassion and not dismissed in any way.

Lookin' good Balody, thx for the variety of pics! Continue to keep us posted.

Pat (and others), It should first be said that NG2 truly has *zero* malicious intent, and above all else he wants -- and he wants others -- to recieve the best HT for their themselves. Is their one, or a small handful, of particular clinics which he finds to be "the best" -- yes, but is this position really that harmful, let alone rare? *Many* posters on this forum, even paid ones, often respond to a "forum newb" with the same, small list of doctors in which they should look into and consider. They may very well cushion their words more than NG2, but the intent and impetus behind their recommendations are all quite the same. I would also bet that NG2 actually *advises and tells* people who to "look into".....equal to if not *less* than many of the said people of the forum. Moreover, I don't believe NG2 to be denigrating the work of Coalition doctors; because he personally would end up selecting but a couple, I don't take that to mean that he thinks every other doctor is dogshit.... Can he be brazen and blunt? Ya, and when he states that there are only two Coalition clinics he would actually go to that is indeed both brazen and blunt. But this is one man's opinion -- an opinion which some concur with and express to varying degrees -- and also which some disagree with, and in turn state theirs. At the same time, I understand that NG2's disposition and opinion can seem offensive and insulting, especially to Pat. *However*, NG2 has also expressly stated that he feels this is *the* hairloss forum in the entire internet, with regards to quality and standards! Hell, his post-count indicates as much.... I know for a fact that NG2 felt like his opinion was being belittled and pre-maturely judged by Pat, and that this offended him; and I believe Pat when he says that NG2's private responses were (intentionally) smug and insulting. The bottom line to me is that there has been a private quarral based upon mutual misunderstandings about people's intent and charachter; and that while NG2 may very well hold an opinion of clinics that Pat (and others) disagree with, it simply isn't malicious....harmful....or even rare....enough to warrant such a quick, harsh suspension/ban. Again, by the same -- perhaps to some, ridiculous -- standards that NG2 personally holds for which specific physicians he'd go to, he also finds this to be the highest caliber hairloss forum out there. With regret, I truly find his abscence, and the way it went down, to be a serious detriment to the forum as a whole. As an aside, NG2 is infinitely more even-tempered than can sometimes be gleaned from his posts; and while he can react emotionally when he feels wronged (like many, myself included), the last thing he would want to be would be a "poison" to the forum -- and I know he *never* thought of himself as being anything of that nature.

I agree. To me, this really hasn't been about attacking Epstein's overall ability, or his Coalition status...it's simply, and directly, about helping some patients who are clearly in need of support and information -- yes, they happen to all be from the same doctor in these instances, so of course the inquiries will be geared towards Dr. Epstein and his practice. As mentioned by PGP, his "ASTONISHMENT" and talk of "witch hunts" isn't helping the patients -- or even his cause. Nonetheless, more information (some of which will be supplied by time itself) needs to come through, which is really what the patient's themselves want, and as a community we want as well.

Bisanga would definitely draw my interest.